Paint — It’s one of those things you want to get right. But it’s also apparently one of those things that can cost $100,000 if your boat happens to be in the 40 ton range.
|International Paint LLC||$93,168|
So here is our criteria.
1) Good, not pretty. I could care less about gloss. Durable, is much better than gloss. Epoxy chalks in the sun and chalking is fine.
2) Basic color selection. Black, Grey, Yellow, Red and we are good. And the yellow and red are not mandatory.
3) Convenient: Single part, Water based, No problem with flash rust., No shelf life, No minimum re-coat time.
Topsides 4200 sq ft
Hull Interior 4200 sq ft
Below the Waterline 1500 sq ft
Apparently boat paint folks break the boat up into three major sections. The bottom, which is anything at or below the waterline. The bottom, gets more water resistant paint and then a couple of coats of some type of anti-fouling to keep the barnacles at bay. The interior, which is self explanatory, gets the least attention. And everything else or the Topsides. In pursuit of vanity, the topsides for yachts can be insanely complicated, which makes me so glad I am building a work boat.
International Paint manufactures the Awlgrip and Interlux lines and by all accounts it’s great paint. And for the price it should be. The real advantage International has is the Hullgard product. It has to go on right after the primer but once it is on you have 6 months before you have to apply the latter coats. Problem is that it’s only on the paint schedule for the topside paint.
Hempel and Sherwin-Williams are more in the price range that we are looking for, but there are lots of paints out there and we are just scratching the surface at this point. This post is more notes than anything else at this point. Suggestions and comments are welcomed. –Doug
Mick O’Briens BoatWe had kicked the idea around of using rust converters. Especially on the inside of the hull where sand blasting would be the most difficult and where the steel is least exposed. But until I got an email from Mick O’Brien in Australia, I had no report from anyone who had actually used it on a boat. Mick built his steel boat in 2001 and used, “Metalfix” an Australian rust converter product from www.phoenixpaints.com.au. on the interior. And thirteen years later the new owner of Mick’s boat reports no rust at all, not even in the bilge.
I asked Mick what sold him on the product. His reply “I spoke to a bloke who owned a large trawler about the size of “SEEKER” and he suggested “Metalfix” for the inside. The paint was hard to find in the east of Australia and I rang the owner/ manufacture of Pheonix Paints in Perth and had a good chat he told one company in the west building large fishing trawlers actually use “Metalfix” inside and out!! I painted a scrape piece of 4mm steel with “Metalfix and hung off the jetty for 3 months just to see? Zero results hardly any growth no rust bleeding and remember it’s water based!! It also has fire retardant qualities. I fell in love with this product and would highly recommend it, and have converted many skeptics.”
I am not ready to try it on the exposed hull but it certainly is worth more investigation for the interior. If you have ever used a sand blaster, even a dustless system in side a car body, you will understand the motivation.
POR-15 , POR-15_TD-RustPreventive, brush, degrease, then phosphoric acid prep, 350 sq. ft per gal, 3 coats needed, 1 gal $126 (grey and black)
Hull Interior 4200 sq ft * 2 coats / 400 sq ft per gallon coverage * 1.2 percent waste = approx 25 gal @ $126 / gal = $3150
POR 15 Cleaner Degrease, dilute 1:1 to 1:10, 4 gallons @ $30 = $120
POR 14 Metal Prep, zinc phosphate, 200 sq ft per gallon, 22 gal @ $40 =$880
Zero-Rust, Phenolic Alkyd, 288 sq ft per gal, 3 mil DFT, 2 coats, alternating the Black or Red-Oxide, 1 gal $77.50 ZR-Application-Guide MSDS
Hull Interior 4200 sq ft * 2 coats / 288 sq ft per gallon coverage * 1.2 percent waste = 35 gallons * $78 = $2,730
Rustoleum, 3575 System Rust-Reformer
TotalBoat Rust Primer, phosphoric acid, 500 sq ft per gal, 1 gal $23.99
Sprayable Rust Converter, Tannic acid, 300 sq ft per gal, 1 gal $48.99
Corroseal, gallic acid, 200 sq ft per gal, 1 gal $57.99
Gemplers, phosphoric acid, 500 sq ft per gal, 2 coats, 1 gal $43.65
Ospho Phosphoric, Dichromate, Wetting Agents and Extenders, $43 ( including shipping)
Interstate Products, Rust Converter, 2 coats, $40
PPG Amerlock sealer
Phoenix Paints 011 61 8 9314 2219
Metalfix 1000 from Australia. $277.35AUD, $194.34USD / 10liter/2.64gallons About $74/gallon 640 litres 170 gallons/pallet $12,580USD
Coverage 285 sq ft / gal, 170 gallons can do the entire boat with 4 coats, 2 is the minimum.
Pallet Shipping: ???
KnockOut (primer) & RustOx KnockOut & RustOx-MPDS
KnockOut: 360-400 sq ft, 1 coat, brush or roller, topcoat after 20 min and dry to touch. 1 gal $120
RustOx: 250 sq ft, 2 coats. brush, roller, or sprayer, 1 gal $119
Hull Interior 4200 sq ft * 1 coats / 360 sq ft per gallon coverage * 1.2 percent waste = 14 gallons * $120 = $1,680
4200 * 2 / 250 *1.2 = 41 * 119 = $4,879 + $1,680 = $6559
Rust Doctor, converter/primer, 200 sq ft per gallon, 1 coat, brush or roller, topcoat after 24 hours. 1 gal at $156
We got a great price on Rust Doctor from a viewer and have tested it with rusted steel, that was first degreased with Purple Power and then top coated with coal tar.
International Paint LLC
Awlgrip base coat: Max Cor CF http://www.awlgrip.com/products/primers/max-cor-cf.aspx
Interlux base coat: Interprotect HS (YPA420) http://www.yachtpaint.com/LiteratureCentre/interprotect_hs_info_usa_eng.pdf
Michael Kent firstname.lastname@example.org
6001 Antoine Drive
Houston, Texas 77091
Tel: +1 713 682 1711
Regarding pricing, we sell through distribution. We have a distributor in Kemah, Tx. That does a very good job and stocks the entire product line. Their name is Blackburn Marine, 281-334-5474 or you can email Casey at email@example.com
Topsides 4200 sq ft
Coat #1, Max Cor CF (metal treatment), R4330-G, 1gal base and R3330 1/2 gal converter, Coverage 910-1518 sq. ft. @ 0.8-1.4 mils wft., one coat by airless.
(4200*1.2 waste)/910=5.5 gal => 5 gal
5 – 1 gal – R4330-G $184.10
5 – 1/2 gal – R3330-HG $65.70
( 184.10 + 65.70 ) x 5 = $1,249.00
Coat #2, Hullgard Extra, Anticorrosive primer, D6120 1 gal base and D3730 1 qt converter, Coverage 185 sq. ft. at 9 mils wft, one coat by airless.
Reducer is not normally necessary unless applied during cooler weather, Reducer T0006, 5%. Do not reduce more than 15%
(4200*1.2)/185=27.24 gal => 27 gal
27 – 1 gal D6120 $61.00
27 – 1 qt D3730 $19.68
2 – 1 gal T0006-GL (Optional for cold weather) $38.55
(61.00+19.68) x 27 = $2178.36
Blast and apply paint within 8 hours, then apply Hullgard Extra to give up to 6 months before overcoating.
Coat #3, High Build, Epoxy Primer, D8002 1 gal base and D3002 1 gal converter, 111-157 sq. gt. @ 8-10 mils wft, one coat by airless, Reduce 10-20% with T0006.
(4200*1.2)/111=45.4 gal => 45 gal
45 – 1 gal D8002 $86.60
45 – 1 gal D3002 $89.03
3 – 1 gal T0006 (Optional for cold weather) $38.55
(86.60+89.03) x 45 = $7,903.35
Coat #4, Awlquik Epoxy Primer Surfacer, D8003 1 gal base and D9001, 203-305 sq. ft @ 5 mils wft. Reduce as necessary up to 50% with T0006.
(4200*1.2)/203=24.8 => 25
25 – 1 gal D8003 $94.60
25 – 1 gal D9001 $94.60
10 – 1 gal T0006 (40% estimate) $38.55
((94.60+94.60) x 25 ) + (38.55 x 10) = $5,115.00
Coat #5,6,7: Awlgrip Polyester Urethane Topcoat (Many Colors), 1 gal base and G3010 1 gal converter, 210 sq. ft.@ recommended film thickness, 2-3 coats at 3-4 mils wft., reduced 25% with T0003 or T0001 depending on the weather.
72 – 1 gal G2017 Super Jet Black $170 (estimated)
72 – 1 gal G3010 $155.86
18 – 1 gal T0001 (Optional for cold weather) $41.42
((170+155.86) x 72) + (41.42 x 18) = $24,207.00
Total Topsides: 1,249+2178.36+7,903.3+5,115+24,207= $40,652.00
Hull Interior 4200 sq ft
3 coats of Interlux InterProtect 2000HS E-3G, 3 gal base and Y2001EG 3/4 gal converter. 151 sq. ft. @ 10 mils wft, can be applied in one coat with an airless. Reduce if necessary with 2316N.
(4200*3*1.2)/151=100 => 100 gal
100 – 2.25 gal, 2000E-3G $239.99
100 – 3/4 gal, Y2001EG $77.99
Below the Waterline 1500 sq ft
Underwater Hull: 1,500ft² – 5 coats of Interprotect, and 2 coats of Micron (CSC Y5583) 9 gallons
5 coats of Interlux Interprotect 2000HS, high solids anti corrosive epoxy primer. 151 Sq. Ft. @ 10 mils wft, can be applied in one coat with an airless. Reduce if necessary with 2316N.
(1500*1.2*5)/151=59.6 => 60 gal
60 – 2.25 gal, 2000E-3G $239.99
60 – 3/4 gal, Y2001EG $77.99
Antifouling, Micron CSC, 5583G, 1 gal, a polishing ablative/copolymer that can live in or out of the water. 440 Sq. Ft. @ 6-8 mils wft. I would recommend an additional coat on the high wear areas such as the leading edge of the bow, keel, rudder and waterline.
(1500*1.2*2)/440= 8.18 => 8 gal
8 – 1 gal, 5583G, $204.99
(204.99 * 8) = $1,639.92
Totals Below the Waterline: 19,078.8+1,639.92= $20,718.72
Total Topsides, Interior, and Bottom: 40,652.00+31,798.00+20,718.72 = $93,168.72
Advisor Notes Prior to blasting ensure the surface is free of any oil deposits. After blasting, blow down with clean dry compressed air to remove all traces of the blast medium. All areas to be coated should then be primed within 4 hours and before any visible signs of oxidation occurs. Any filling and fairing should not be carried out until after the first coat of a suitable primer has been applied.
Michael Syhler, Account Manager
Hempel (USA), Inc.
600 Conroe Park North Dr, Conroe, TX, 77303, USA
Mobile # (+1) 713 444 6182
Keep it simple?
I’m attaching a paint spec for two paint systems:
– One for UW Hull
– One for all other areas
The “all other areas” uses HEMPADUR MASTIC 45881 as a topcoat.
It can be tinted in whatever colour desired and we also have some standard shades we can grab off the shelve.
Following is expected usage per 1000 sq ft with a 30% loss:
HEMPADUR GF MS EPOXY 3587A Grey 11480 @ 10 mil 10-11 Gallons (Everywhere)
HEMPADUR MASTIC 45881 var colours @ 5 mil 6 Gallons (Topside Topcoat)
ANTIFOULING OLYMPIC 76600 Red 51110 @ 5 mil 7 Gallons (Anti-Fouling)
PRICING (based on supply in 5 gallon kits, incl Part A and B):
3587A Grey 11480 @ $70.18 per gallon (Everywhere)
45881 Oxide Red 50630 @ $43.13 per gallon (same price for Lt grey 12170, Black 19990) (Topside Topcoat)
45881 Safety yellow @ $85.97 per gallon (Topside Topcoat)
45881 Safett red @ $59.46 per gallon (Topside Topcoat)
08450 @ $26.46 per gallon Thinner for all epoxies, HEMPADUR
08080 @ $25.59 per gallon Thinner for anti-fouling, OLYMPIC
Hempel Gal./1K SqFt Gallons/Coat Coats Gallons Num 5 gal kits Total Gallons Cost/Gal Tot Cost
Hempadur GF MS Epoxy grey 11 92 1 92 19 95 70.18 6667.1
Hempadur Mastic red oxid, lt grey, black 6 50 1 50 11 55 43.13 2372.15
AntiFouling Olympic 7 59 2 118 24 120 65 7800
HEMPADUR MASTIC 45880-45881
HEMPADUR MULTI-STRENGTH GF 3587A
HEMPEL’S AF OLYMPIC HI 76600
Coal Tar – The old standby.
Robin Czaia: Coal Tar. Before (expensive) epoxies there was Coal Tar and it’s use was pervasive in the maritime arena. The first thing the Paint Co.s did when (expensive) epoxies were invented was to add them to Coal Tar and market it as a miracle paint at Only 10 Xs the price of regular -hardware store bought Coal Tar. Fast forward 30 years and look at those $120/gal. paint adverts and many of them still reference Coal Tar Epoxies and how there product is better. Coal tar is used as a base in the paint industry (and not just for CT Epoxy). By adding epox they took a really good product and dulled some it’s amazing characteristics, like it’s long term flexability and it’s self healing tendency. The hype from the coatings industry has nearly killed Coal Tar. But at $40 for a 5 gallon pail, I say Awesome! P.S. We’ve got 25 gals of the stuff for the interior. We’ve spilled 2 pails at various times on the boat -lost one entire pail to the wind 80mph. – and that stuff is near impossible to remove without Sand Blasting. That being said, it is still used as a coating below the waterline on barges and sailboats alike. I don’t doubt that you could paint your whole boat with the stuff. As an aside coal tar is an approved coating for the inside of pottable water tanks. And Finally, although a shot blasted surface is the preferred substrate, suitable protection can be obtained over tight rust, mill scale and other minor imperfections. Further reading here: https://web.anl.gov/…/09_4_ATLANTIC%20CITY_09-65_0179.pdf
National Paint 8003K Blue Water Marine Coal Tar Epoxy Primer $72.69 1/gal
Rust-Oleum C9578 System Coal Tar Epoxy $55.08 1/gal
Krylon® Coal Tar Epoxy $121.29 3/gal $40.00 1/gal
Sherwin-Williams TarGuard Coal Tar Epoxy
Carboline Bitumastic 300M
Sherwin-Williams Commercial Paint Store Doug Hawkins, District Manager
Steve Hallum, Outside Sales
Recommendation from: Pro Line, San Diago, Garry 619 231 2313, firstname.lastname@example.org
Macropoxy 646 B58B600 Black B58V600 catalyst comes in black, white, safety red and safety yellow. MACROPOXY_646
Macropoxy PW ( Potable Water )
MACROPOXY 646 $45.00/gallon (mill white) 10 gallon kits. 40 kits required. Total $18,000 $39.45
Sea Guard 5000 ( same as above “cousins” but comes in many colors ) SEAGUARD_5000
Both are 1:1 Mix in 2 and 10 gallon kits. Black, Off White, Red Deck, Green, Gray, Buff
169@ 10 mils, 234@ 7 mils, $39.45/gal
Bottom Paint is Sea Guard P304 SW
TarGuard Coal Tar Epoxy Black and Red.
74 sq ft @ 22 mils, 148 @ 11 mils
Ext&Bottom 5700sqft / 148@11mils * 2 coats = 77gal * ?? = $
PPG Lindsay Moncrief 832 684 6959 Lindsay.Moncrief@ppg.com
Armorshield 235 & 240 (240 is better at holding on corners.) Urethane
PSX 700 Engineered Siloxane 2-part
PSX One 1-part
Spectrum Paint, Tulsa
Jake Richards, Sales Rep (918) 230 1226
Quote: DOUG JACKSON BOAT PROJECT
Product Price Qty
Dimetcote 9, Primer for PSX 700
AMRPX7003/01 PSX700 PART A RESIN GALLON $128.10 1
AMRPX700-B/04 PSX700 PART B CATALYST/HARDNER QUART $31.00 4
PSX_700 Unlimited recoat time, 289 @ 5mils (roller) 2 coats
Ext&Bottom 5700 / 289 * 2 = 40gal * 160 = $6,400 (Finish/Topcoat)
Amercoat One, Primer for PSX One
AMRPXONE3/01 PSX1 SERIES POLY SILOXANE GALLON SINGLE COMP. $164.49 1
PSX-One Max 30 day recoat. 600 sq ft @ 2mils 400 sq ft @ 3mils
Ext&Bottom 5700sqft / 400@3mils * 5 coats = 72gal * 165 = $11,880
AMRAT78HB-B/16 COAL TAR EPOXY PART B 1/2 PINT CATALYST/HARD $9.50 16
AMRAT78HB-9/01 COAL TAR EPOXY PART A RESIN GALLON $39.20 1
Amercoat 78HB 1 coat = 16 mils, 78 sq ft, 12 to 24 hr recoat, No primer or topcoat needed. Above and below-water, Red&Black
Ext&Bottom 5700sqft / 78@16mils * 1 coats = 74gal * 49 = $3,630
AMRAT235-20/01 AMERCOAT 235 EPOXY RESIN PART A GALLON $54.75 1
AMRAT235-B/04 AMERCOAT 235 EPOXY PART B CATALYST QUART $13.70 4
Amercoat 235 Max 30 day recoat. 218 sq ft @ 8 mils, 2 coats, Above and below-water, Haze Gray, Med. Gray, Black, Off-White, Buff, Oxide Red, Med. Green
Ext&Bottom 5700 / 218 * 2 = 53g * 69= $3,657
—- Paint Test ————————————————————————————————————————————————————
Cup brush and wire wheels
Apply studs for insulation, 1.5 ft apart vertical, 1 ft apart
Pressure Wash with Holdtight 102 – Flash Rust Inhibitor 50:1 added to pressure washer intake from 55 gallon drum.
Testex Press-O-Film Replica Tape 1.4 – 4.5 mil
Test Dry – Tape saran wrap over surface and check for condensation after 15 to 20 minutes.
Rockwool 1 layers of 1 in thick, and 1 inch of iso or EPS foam, attached on studs with insulation retainers
Power brush surface, spray POR 15 Cleaner Degrease diluted 1:5, (1:1 to 1:10) and keep wet 10-15 min, then rinse thoroughly and apply POR 154 Metal Prep, zinc phosphate and keep wet 10 to 15 min. Do not apply when the humidity is above 80 percent or if there is a good chance of rain.Allowed to dry and apply 2 thin coats of POR-15. The 2nd coat should be applied when the first coat becomes almost dry, slightly tacky. Do not apply when the humidity is above 80 percent or if there is a good chance of rain. POR-15 is UV sensitive and will fade and turn chalky if exposed to direct sunlight. The best time to apply your top coat is when the 2nd coat of POR-15 becomes almost dry, slightly tacky, typically 2 to 6 hours. To coat over cured POR-15 , scuff the surface with 320 grit sandpaper until gloss is dull, and then apply coating. Moisture will shorten the life of unused POR-15. Seal can immediately after dispensing.
Encor Coatings KnockOut (primer) & RustOx KnockOut & RustOx-MPDS
Power brush surface, degrease and then apply 1 coat KnockOut with brush and topcoat after 20 min and dry to touch with RustOx. Apply 2 coats of RustOx by brush.
Phoenix Paints Metalfix 1000 (primer) & Kingcoat (top coat) Power brush surface, degrease, allow to dry, Metalfix 1000 must be at or above 77F. Apply 2 brush coats and allow to dry overnight. Apply Kingcoat in low humidity and over 77F by brush and allow to dry overnight between coats.
PPG Amercoat 78HB Coal Tar Epoxy, degrease, blast to 2 – 4 mil profile, 19:1 mix, 1 spray coat preferred 20.5 wet mil.
Sherwin-Williams TarGuard Coal Tar Epoxy , degrease, blast to 3 mil profile, 4:1 mix, 1 spray coat preferred 11 to 22 wet mil.
Conventional Spray (bottom feed tank recommended), Gun: Binks 95, Fluid Nozzle: 66 Air Nozzle: 63PB Atomization Pressure: 60 psi, Fluid Pressure: 40 psi, Reduction: up to 10% by volume, Xylene
PPG Amercoat 235 , degrease, blast to 3 mil profile, 4:1 mix, 8 – 10 wet mil, 2 coats, recoat 4 to 30 hrs.
—- Paint Test Results ————————————————————————————————————————————————–
Interior: Pressure wash to remove loos rust and dirt, then use a degreaser like Purple Power before the final rinse then gray Amerlock2 for the floors, and maybe PPG Amercoat 78 HB for the walls in the cargo hold and engine room. Coal Tar will have an odor so we do not want it in either cabin, and it’s black so we don’t want it in the bilges were we need good visibility. We have 12 gallons of gray Amerlock2 that when brushed on should cover 340 sq ft per coat. So 2 two coats less 15% loss, 12 gallons will really cover about (12*340/2)*.85=1734 sq ft or about 40% of the total interior space of 4200 sq ft.
We have 30 gallons of PPG Amercoat 78 HB, At 78 sq ft it will cover less than 2000 sq ft after losses, but it’s enough to do the 1500 sq ft below the waterline.